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<channel>
	<title>Comments on: S5 1.1a2</title>
	<atom:link href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/</link>
	<description>Things that Eric A. Meyer, CSS expert, writes about on his personal Web site; it&#039;s largely Web standards and Web technology, but also various bits of culture, politics, personal observations, and other miscellaneous stuff</description>
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		<item>
		<title>By: christian</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1825</link>
		<dc:creator>christian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2004 12:19:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1825</guid>
		<description>a short function to add new style rules in a cross browser way ( Opera, Fox, IE):

function addStyle(string){
	if(/microsoft/i.test(navigator.appName) &amp;&amp; !/opera/i.test(navigator.userAgent)){
		document.createStyleSheet().cssText=string;
	}
	else {
		var ele=document.createElement(&#039;link&#039;);
		ele.rel=&#039;stylesheet&#039;;
		ele.type=&#039;text/css&#039;;
		ele.href=&#039;data:text/css;charset=utf-8,&#039;+escape(string);
		document.getElementsByTagName(&#039;head&#039;)[0].appendChild(ele);
	}
}

a &lt;a href=&#039;http://aleto.ch/test/increaseFontSize2.html&#039;&gt;test link&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>a short function to add new style rules in a cross browser way ( Opera, Fox, IE):</p>
<p>function addStyle(string){<br />
	if(/microsoft/i.test(navigator.appName) &#038;&#038; !/opera/i.test(navigator.userAgent)){<br />
		document.createStyleSheet().cssText=string;<br />
	}<br />
	else {<br />
		var ele=document.createElement(&#8216;link&#8217;);<br />
		ele.rel=&#8217;stylesheet&#8217;;<br />
		ele.type=&#8217;text/css&#8217;;<br />
		ele.href=&#8217;data:text/css;charset=utf-8,&#8217;+escape(string);<br />
		document.getElementsByTagName(&#8216;head&#8217;)[0].appendChild(ele);<br />
	}<br />
}</p>
<p>a <a href='http://aleto.ch/test/increaseFontSize2.html'>test link</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1820</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:51:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1820</guid>
		<description>Will the incremental bullets be an easily switchable option?  I can see where they can be useful in presentations, but they aren&#039;t needed (or wanted) in every one of my presentations.  Also, I think that the question of whether the bullets should &#039;fade out&#039; one at a time when you press left, or if they should just fade out really comes down to the way you think people use the back feature (perhaps this could be a switchable option as well.)  It would be handy to &#039;undo&#039; one bullet at a time if you accidentally revealed one before you were ready to talk about it.  On the other hand, if you wanted to review a previous slide, it would be a hassle to go back line-by-line.  It really depends on how the individual presenter expects the software to function.  Perhaps these options could go in an &#039;advanced options&#039; configuration file or something, or could be tied in with themes, in order to give people choices.

On another note, I&#039;m not sure if I&#039;ve posted on this software in general.  I think it&#039;s a brilliant project both in its usefulness and its level of sophistication.  It&#039;s truely kind of you to volunteer it to the community.  Thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will the incremental bullets be an easily switchable option?  I can see where they can be useful in presentations, but they aren&#8217;t needed (or wanted) in every one of my presentations.  Also, I think that the question of whether the bullets should &#8216;fade out&#8217; one at a time when you press left, or if they should just fade out really comes down to the way you think people use the back feature (perhaps this could be a switchable option as well.)  It would be handy to &#8216;undo&#8217; one bullet at a time if you accidentally revealed one before you were ready to talk about it.  On the other hand, if you wanted to review a previous slide, it would be a hassle to go back line-by-line.  It really depends on how the individual presenter expects the software to function.  Perhaps these options could go in an &#8216;advanced options&#8217; configuration file or something, or could be tied in with themes, in order to give people choices.</p>
<p>On another note, I&#8217;m not sure if I&#8217;ve posted on this software in general.  I think it&#8217;s a brilliant project both in its usefulness and its level of sophistication.  It&#8217;s truely kind of you to volunteer it to the community.  Thank you.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Leung WC</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1818</link>
		<dc:creator>Leung WC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2004 06:22:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1818</guid>
		<description>What are the target browsers of S5? I mean, Gecko/IE5/IE6/Opera/Safari/Konqueror and/or others.

BTW, pt 2 of my previous comment is &quot;You called setAttribute from a CSSStyleSheet, not a DOM node.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What are the target browsers of S5? I mean, Gecko/IE5/IE6/Opera/Safari/Konqueror and/or others.</p>
<p>BTW, pt 2 of my previous comment is &quot;You called setAttribute from a CSSStyleSheet, not a DOM node.&quot;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1816</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2004 04:40:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1816</guid>
		<description>WC - That seems to be the answer.  Thanks!  The &lt;a href=&quot;/eric/tools/s5/s5-testbed.html&quot;&gt;testbed&lt;/a&gt; has been updated.  After I get a chance to run some extra tests on the new code and try out a couple of ideas, I&#039;ll move the code to 1.1a3 and post anew.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WC &#8211; That seems to be the answer.  Thanks!  The <a href="/eric/tools/s5/s5-testbed.html">testbed</a> has been updated.  After I get a chance to run some extra tests on the new code and try out a couple of ideas, I&#8217;ll move the code to 1.1a3 and post anew.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Leung WC</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1815</link>
		<dc:creator>Leung WC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2004 02:36:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1815</guid>
		<description>Eric,

After inspecting the script in comment 14, I found out that the whole script went wrong! (damn)
&lt;ol&gt;
&lt;li&gt;You didn&#039;t append the &lt;style&gt; element to the document.&lt;/style&gt;&lt;/li&gt;
&lt;li&gt;tAttribute from a CSSStyleSheet, not a DOM node.&lt;/li&gt;
&lt;li&gt;Inserting the rule this way just get Firefox ignoring it (damn again to Firefox this time)&lt;/li&gt;
&lt;/ol&gt;

Finally I made the corrections here:
&lt;code&gt;function fontSize(value) {
&#160;if (!(s5ss = document.getElementById(&#039;s5ss&#039;))) {
&#160;&#160;if (!isIE) {
&#160;&#160;&#160;document.getElementsByTagName(&#039;head&#039;)[0].appendChild(s5ss = document.createElement(&quot;style&quot;));
&#160;&#160;&#160;s5ss.setAttribute(&#039;media&#039;,&#039;screen, projection&#039;);
&#160;&#160;&#160;s5ss.setAttribute(&#039;id&#039;,&#039;s5ss&#039;);
&#160;&#160;} else {
&#160;&#160;&#160;document.createStyleSheet();
&#160;&#160;&#160;document.s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];
&#160;&#160;}
&#160;}

&#160;if (!isIE) {
&#160;&#160;while (s5ss.lastChild) s5ss.removeChild(s5ss.lastChild);
&#160;&#160;s5ss.appendChild(document.createTextNode(&#039;body {font-size: &#039; + value + &#039; !important;}&#039;));
&#160;} else {
&#160;&#160;document.s5ss.addRule(&#039;body&#039;,&#039;font-size: &#039; + value + &#039; !important;&#039;);
&#160;}
}&lt;/code&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric,</p>
<p>After inspecting the script in comment 14, I found out that the whole script went wrong! (damn)</p>
<ol>
<li>You didn&#8217;t append the<br />
<style> element to the document.</style>
</li>
<li>tAttribute from a CSSStyleSheet, not a DOM node.</li>
<li>Inserting the rule this way just get Firefox ignoring it (damn again to Firefox this time)</li>
</ol>
<p>Finally I made the corrections here:<br />
<code>function fontSize(value) {<br />
&nbsp;if (!(s5ss = document.getElementById('s5ss'))) {<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;if (!isIE) {<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(s5ss = document.createElement("style"));<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;s5ss.setAttribute('media','screen, projection');<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;s5ss.setAttribute('id','s5ss');<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;} else {<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;document.createStyleSheet();<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;document.s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;}<br />
&nbsp;}</p>
<p>&nbsp;if (!isIE) {<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;while (s5ss.lastChild) s5ss.removeChild(s5ss.lastChild);<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;s5ss.appendChild(document.createTextNode('body {font-size: ' + value + ' !important;}'));<br />
&nbsp;} else {<br />
&nbsp;&nbsp;document.s5ss.addRule('body','font-size: ' + value + ' !important;');<br />
&nbsp;}<br />
}</code></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt O'Dell</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1814</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt O'Dell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 18:36:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1814</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s another brief thing to possibly add to the to do list. Not exactly sure how to fix it, but in Firefox, when I try to select text to copy, if it&#039;s within the same bullet, it acts like I clicked the mouse to move onto the next slide. If I select text across multiple bullets, it doesn&#039;t move on. I have no clue why it would do one and not the other. 

It&#039;s not a huge problem, for if you were using powerpoint you wouldn&#039;t be able to select text, but it might be a nice feature to be able to select and copy text if someone wants to. Just an idea</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s another brief thing to possibly add to the to do list. Not exactly sure how to fix it, but in Firefox, when I try to select text to copy, if it&#8217;s within the same bullet, it acts like I clicked the mouse to move onto the next slide. If I select text across multiple bullets, it doesn&#8217;t move on. I have no clue why it would do one and not the other. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s not a huge problem, for if you were using powerpoint you wouldn&#8217;t be able to select text, but it might be a nice feature to be able to select and copy text if someone wants to. Just an idea</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1811</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 16:21:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1811</guid>
		<description>Okay, I&#039;ve hit a serious wall.  Here&#039;s as far as I got with the style sheet creation code:

&lt;code&gt;function fontSize(value) {
	if (!document.getElementById(&#039;s5ss&#039;)) {
		if (!isIE) {
			document.createElement(&#039;style&#039;);
			s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];
		} else {
			document.createStyleSheet();
			document.s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];
		}
		s5ss.setAttribute(&#039;media&#039;,&#039;screen, projection&#039;);
		s5ss.setAttribute(&#039;id&#039;,&#039;s5ss&#039;);
	}
	if (!isIE) {
		s5ss.insertRule(&#039;body {font-size: &#039; + value + &#039; !important;}&#039;,0);
	} else {
		document.s5ss.addRule(&#039;body&#039;,&#039;font-size: &#039; + value + &#039; !important;&#039;);
	}
}&lt;/code&gt;

That gets me the following error in Firefox: &quot;Error: s5ss.setAttribute is not a function&quot;.  Which seems weird, because I use it elsewhere in the JS without incident.  Anyone know what&#039;s going on and, more importantly, how to fix it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, I&#8217;ve hit a serious wall.  Here&#8217;s as far as I got with the style sheet creation code:</p>
<p><code>function fontSize(value) {<br />
	if (!document.getElementById('s5ss')) {<br />
		if (!isIE) {<br />
			document.createElement('style');<br />
			s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];<br />
		} else {<br />
			document.createStyleSheet();<br />
			document.s5ss = document.styleSheets[document.styleSheets.length - 1];<br />
		}<br />
		s5ss.setAttribute('media','screen, projection');<br />
		s5ss.setAttribute('id','s5ss');<br />
	}<br />
	if (!isIE) {<br />
		s5ss.insertRule('body {font-size: ' + value + ' !important;}',0);<br />
	} else {<br />
		document.s5ss.addRule('body','font-size: ' + value + ' !important;');<br />
	}<br />
}</code></p>
<p>That gets me the following error in Firefox: &#8220;Error: s5ss.setAttribute is not a function&#8221;.  Which seems weird, because I use it elsewhere in the JS without incident.  Anyone know what&#8217;s going on and, more importantly, how to fix it?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1810</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 15:32:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1810</guid>
		<description>RDF-- thanks, but no thanks.  Since it turns out I&#039;d misunderstood the nature of &lt;code&gt;meta&lt;/code&gt; elements, I&#039;m going to concentrate on that approach instead.  I&#039;m just curious what the meaning (if any) would be of this:

&lt;code&gt;&lt;meta name=&quot;author&quot; content=&quot;Eric Meyer, Complex Spiral Consulting&quot; /&gt;
&lt;meta name=&quot;author&quot; content=&quot;Joe Public, ConHugeCo Corp.&quot; /&gt;&lt;/code&gt;

Does that imply the second value will overwrite the first?  Are they concatenated instead, and if so, how?  Granted, the point of the &lt;code&gt;meta&lt;/code&gt; elements is to be human-readable but I&#039;d like to avoid any machine-read problems.

Print size changing-- hmmm, no, that wasn&#039;t intentional.  That&#039;s happening due to the dynamically added style sheet that sets the font size, since if you toggle to outline view and print, the font size is normal.  We need to restrict the created style sheet to &lt;code&gt;media=&quot;screen, projection&quot;&lt;/code&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RDF&#8211; thanks, but no thanks.  Since it turns out I&#8217;d misunderstood the nature of <code>meta</code> elements, I&#8217;m going to concentrate on that approach instead.  I&#8217;m just curious what the meaning (if any) would be of this:</p>
<p><code>&lt;meta name="author" content="Eric Meyer, Complex Spiral Consulting" /&gt;<br />
&lt;meta name="author" content="Joe Public, ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;</code></p>
<p>Does that imply the second value will overwrite the first?  Are they concatenated instead, and if so, how?  Granted, the point of the <code>meta</code> elements is to be human-readable but I&#8217;d like to avoid any machine-read problems.</p>
<p>Print size changing&#8211; hmmm, no, that wasn&#8217;t intentional.  That&#8217;s happening due to the dynamically added style sheet that sets the font size, since if you toggle to outline view and print, the font size is normal.  We need to restrict the created style sheet to <code>media="screen, projection"</code>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Micha</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1807</link>
		<dc:creator>Micha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:50:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1807</guid>
		<description>Is the change in the text size for printing intentional? In an earlier version of S5, up to five slides were printed on each page. With this testfile, I see only three slides on the first page in the Firefox Print Preview. I believe the old printing was better...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is the change in the text size for printing intentional? In an earlier version of S5, up to five slides were printed on each page. With this testfile, I see only three slides on the first page in the Firefox Print Preview. I believe the old printing was better&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Martin Hense</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1806</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin Hense</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:24:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1806</guid>
		<description>There is an indirect possibility of listing multiple Authors in the header of an XHTML-document. You can represent the whole project-author relationship with an RDF-document and simply link to that document within your XHTML header. This is the way dublincore.org does it with larger information structures since years:
&lt;i&gt;link rel=&quot;meta&quot; href=&quot;index.rdf&quot;&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is an indirect possibility of listing multiple Authors in the header of an XHTML-document. You can represent the whole project-author relationship with an RDF-document and simply link to that document within your XHTML header. This is the way dublincore.org does it with larger information structures since years:<br />
<i>link rel=&#8221;meta&#8221; href=&#8221;index.rdf&#8221;</i></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Laurens Holst</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1804</link>
		<dc:creator>Laurens Holst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1804</guid>
		<description>http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/global.html#edef-META

Looks like it can be anything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/global.html#edef-META" rel="nofollow">http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/global.html#edef-META</a></p>
<p>Looks like it can be anything.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lou Rutker</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1800</link>
		<dc:creator>Lou Rutker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 05:14:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1800</guid>
		<description>The incremental objects seem to work vry nicely, butbseem to only work when moving forward. When moving back it movs one full slide at a time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The incremental objects seem to work vry nicely, butbseem to only work when moving forward. When moving back it movs one full slide at a time.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1799</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 05:10:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1799</guid>
		<description>The &lt;a href=&quot;/eric/tools/s5/s5-testbed.html&quot;&gt;testbed&lt;/a&gt; now has incremental objects working.  It even has a new feature where, via the class name, you can indicate if you want the first child to be pre-revealed, or if you want all the children to be faded.  (Or whatever CSS effect is used in the theme.)

The interface at this point is that any keyboard or mouse-click advance will trigger incremental display, &lt;em&gt;except&lt;/em&gt; clicking on the &quot;next slide&quot; link in the lower right-hand corner.  Using that link will jump you to the next slide regardless of the state of incremental display on the current slide.  What I&#039;m trying to figure out is if reverse keyboard events (left arrow, page up, etc.) should run the incremental display back a step, or jump straight to the previous slide.  At the moment, the JS does the latter, but I&#039;m becoming convinced it should do the former.  I&#039;ll have to tackle that in the near future.

At the moment, the testbed&#039;s styles are really only set up to handle incremental bullet points, and only when they&#039;re text to boot.  I&#039;m still looking at Henryk&#039;s approach to incremental graphics, and thinking about how I want things to work, and whether or not the two are at all different.  They may not be.  We&#039;ll see.

Lachlan: so are you saying that commas aren&#039;t a problem in named &lt;code&gt;meta&lt;/code&gt; elements, that they don&#039;t imply a concatentation of some kind?  So I could have values like &lt;code&gt;&quot;Eric Meyer, Complex Spiral; Joe Public, ConHugeCo Corp.&quot;&lt;/code&gt; and not run into trouble?  That would make me really, really happy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The <a href="/eric/tools/s5/s5-testbed.html">testbed</a> now has incremental objects working.  It even has a new feature where, via the class name, you can indicate if you want the first child to be pre-revealed, or if you want all the children to be faded.  (Or whatever CSS effect is used in the theme.)</p>
<p>The interface at this point is that any keyboard or mouse-click advance will trigger incremental display, <em>except</em> clicking on the &#8220;next slide&#8221; link in the lower right-hand corner.  Using that link will jump you to the next slide regardless of the state of incremental display on the current slide.  What I&#8217;m trying to figure out is if reverse keyboard events (left arrow, page up, etc.) should run the incremental display back a step, or jump straight to the previous slide.  At the moment, the JS does the latter, but I&#8217;m becoming convinced it should do the former.  I&#8217;ll have to tackle that in the near future.</p>
<p>At the moment, the testbed&#8217;s styles are really only set up to handle incremental bullet points, and only when they&#8217;re text to boot.  I&#8217;m still looking at Henryk&#8217;s approach to incremental graphics, and thinking about how I want things to work, and whether or not the two are at all different.  They may not be.  We&#8217;ll see.</p>
<p>Lachlan: so are you saying that commas aren&#8217;t a problem in named <code>meta</code> elements, that they don&#8217;t imply a concatentation of some kind?  So I could have values like <code>"Eric Meyer, Complex Spiral; Joe Public, ConHugeCo Corp."</code> and not run into trouble?  That would make me really, really happy.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lachlan Hunt</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1798</link>
		<dc:creator>Lachlan Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Nov 2004 05:01:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1798</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand why your comparing HTTP header syntax with the &lt;code&gt;&lt;meta&gt;&lt;/code&gt; element, when you&#039;ve used the &lt;code&gt;name&lt;/code&gt; attribute.  It doesn&#039;t use the HTTP header field syntax unless it&#039;s used with the &lt;code&gt;http-equiv&lt;/code&gt; attribute, which should generally be avoided in favour of real HTTP headers anyway.

The best way to do meta data in a standardised way is using the &lt;a href=&quot;http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/&quot;&gt;Dublin Core&lt;/a&gt;.  I haven&#039;t read it all in detail, so I don&#039;t know how it supports multiple authors

Finally, Ugly Virgin (if that is your real name :-), the correct way to encode an ampersand to display, as you tried in comments 1 and 2, is to write it as &lt;code&gt;&amp;&lt;/code&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand why your comparing HTTP header syntax with the <code>&lt;meta&gt;</code> element, when you&#8217;ve used the <code>name</code> attribute.  It doesn&#8217;t use the HTTP header field syntax unless it&#8217;s used with the <code>http-equiv</code> attribute, which should generally be avoided in favour of real HTTP headers anyway.</p>
<p>The best way to do meta data in a standardised way is using the <a href="http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/">Dublin Core</a>.  I haven&#8217;t read it all in detail, so I don&#8217;t know how it supports multiple authors</p>
<p>Finally, Ugly Virgin (if that is your real name :-), the correct way to encode an ampersand to display, as you tried in comments 1 and 2, is to write it as <code>&amp;amp;</code>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Henryk Pl</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1791</link>
		<dc:creator>Henryk Pl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Nov 2004 23:58:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comment-1791</guid>
		<description>Moin,

I know, that was sort of a &#039;design decision&#039; (others would probably call it an ugly hack) because I didn&#039;t want to do bigger modifications to the js. And also because I have no idea how users really would want it to behave. I did it this way because we were presenting with a cordless mouse.

If you give me your opinions about what the interface should be like I would take up the task of modifying it to behave this way. (And clean the code up for inclusion in the latest version.)

-- 
Henryk Pl</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Moin,</p>
<p>I know, that was sort of a &#8216;design decision&#8217; (others would probably call it an ugly hack) because I didn&#8217;t want to do bigger modifications to the js. And also because I have no idea how users really would want it to behave. I did it this way because we were presenting with a cordless mouse.</p>
<p>If you give me your opinions about what the interface should be like I would take up the task of modifying it to behave this way. (And clean the code up for inclusion in the latest version.)</p>
<p>&#8211;<br />
Henryk Pl</p>
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<h3><a href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/" rel="bookmark" title="Permanent Link: S<sup>5</sup> 1.1a2">S<sup>5</sup> 1.1a2</a></h3>
<ul class="meta">
<li class="date">Wed 10 Nov 2004</li>
<li class="time">1458</li>
<li class="cat"><a href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/category/tech/s5/" title="View all posts in S5" rel="category tag">S5</a><br> <a href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/category/tech/tools/" title="View all posts in Tools" rel="category tag">Tools</a></li>
<li class="cmt"><a href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/11/10/s5-11a2/#comments">20 responses</a></li>
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<p>
I&#8217;ve posted an update to the <a href="/eric/tools/s5/s5-testbed.html">testbed file</a> that incorporates the <a href="/eric/thoughts/2004/11/07/s5-11a1/#comment-1781">new font-scaling routines</a> from Micha&euml;l, and also a slightly corrected version of the <a href="/eric/thoughts/2004/10/02/slide-show-beta-2/#comment-1158">internal-link slide routines contributed by Henryk Pl&ouml;tz back in the 1.0b2 days</a>.  These routines all seem to work fine, except the internal-link routines don&#8217;t seem to work at all in Safari.  I tried several times to fix it, but I can&#8217;t figure out the problem.  So fixing that is now on the to do list.
</p>
<p>
Speaking of which, here&#8217;s the current to-do list for S<sup>5</sup> 1.1, categorized by their importance.  Any of these are, of course, subject to modification, deletion, and so forth.
</p>
<ol>
<li>A way to trigger simple in-slide changes by hitting &#8220;next&#8221;.  For example, having a list of bullet points appear one at a time as the space bar (or other &#8220;next&#8221; action) is hit, and then moving on to the next slide.</li>
<li>The ability to cleanly list multiple authors in the metadata.  I&#8217;ll get back to this in just a minute.</li>
<li>Better, possibly more dynamic, theme selection.  I don&#8217;t know how yet, nor am I sure how it might impact the outline/slide show view toggling.</li>
<li>A way to choose whether to show/hide all of the navigation controls, or just the menu.  Ordinarily, I&#8217;d say &#8220;do it in the CSS!&#8221; and you can in fact do that right now&#8230; as long as you don&#8217;t care that the behavior won&#8217;t be quite right in Internet Explorer.  The problem is that I&#8217;m not quite sure how to manage this in a fully cross-browser fashion, short of scanning the CSS files for certain rules, and firing JS based on that.  Which, frankly, sounds kind of ooky.  Adding that information via a <code>meta</code> tag doesn&#8217;t seem like the right answer, but maybe I&#8217;m wrong.</li>
<li>A way to indicate the target resolution in the CSS, so that the scripts can use that for scaling purposes (thus making the scaling more intelligent).  I&#8217;m not really sure this is needed, and I&#8217;m open to being convinced one way or the other.</li>
</ol>
<p>
If there&#8217;s anything missing, let me know.  Also feel free to comment on what you think of the above plans.
</p>
<p>
Now for the metadata situation.  As I understand things, having read RFC 2068, you can have multiple HTTP headers that share a name so long as they&#8217;re interpreted as a comma-separated list of values associated with that name.  (Apologies if I&#8217;m mangling terminology, but HTTP headers aren&#8217;t really my thing.)  So given the following:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta name="author" content="Eric Meyer" /&gt;
&lt;meta name="affiliation" content="Complex Spiral Consulting" /&gt;
&lt;meta name="author" content="Joe Public" /&gt;
&lt;meta name="affiliation" content="ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
&#8230;this is an equivalent construction:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta name="author" content="Eric Meyer, Joe Public" /&gt;
&lt;meta name="affiliation" content="Complex Spiral Consulting, ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
I find this to be a long way from ideal.  In addition, since commas are the default value separator, if I understand the situation correctly,  I can&#8217;t really do something like this:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta name="authors" content="Eric Meyer, Complex Spiral Consulting; Joe Public, ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
&#8230;because that ends up as equivalent to:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta name="authors" content="Eric Meyer" /&gt;
&lt;meta name="authors" content="Complex Spiral Consulting; Joe Public /&gt;
&lt;meta name="authors" content="ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
That&#8217;s even further from ideal.  So here&#8217;s my current thinking for a way to represent multiple authors and affiliations:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta
 name="authors"
 content="Eric Meyer - Complex Spiral Consulting, Joe Public - ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
Anyone have a better idea than what I&#8217;ve proposed?  I&#8217;d love to hear it.  As part of said proposal, please keep in mind possible expansion of the information carried in the <code>meta</code> element.  For example, titles might be added, which in my current thinking would go like this:
</p>
<pre>
&lt;meta
 name="authors"
 content="Eric Meyer - Principal Consultant - Complex Spiral Consulting, 
          Joe Public - VP of IF - ConHugeCo Corp." /&gt;
</pre>
<p>
It isn&#8217;t pretty, but it conforms to my understanding of <code>meta</code> value syntax.  As I say, I&#8217;d be very happy to be shown a better way of forming the <code>meta</code> values.
</p></div>

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