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	<title>Comments on: Ordering the Link States</title>
	<atom:link href="http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/</link>
	<description>Things that Eric A. Meyer, CSS expert, writes about on his personal Web site; it&#039;s largely Web standards and Web technology, but also various bits of culture, politics, personal observations, and other miscellaneous stuff</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: BUUP • the most reckless compilation of preposterous rants &#187; Ten CSS tips designers should know or learn</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-502130</link>
		<dc:creator>BUUP • the most reckless compilation of preposterous rants &#187; Ten CSS tips designers should know or learn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2010 18:39:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-502130</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] 10. link-visited-hover-active (LVHA) rule Masters of the dark arts of specificity know why this rule exists and how it does or doesn&#8217;t apply, but if you&#8217;re still a padawan in these matters (or just rusty), you can get a quick refresher from this old chestnut of mine. &#8212; by Eric Meyer [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 10. link-visited-hover-active (LVHA) rule Masters of the dark arts of specificity know why this rule exists and how it does or doesn&#8217;t apply, but if you&#8217;re still a padawan in these matters (or just rusty), you can get a quick refresher from this old chestnut of mine. &#8212; by Eric Meyer [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: CSS Code Snippets : 15 Wicked Tricks &#124; DevSnippets</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-438859</link>
		<dc:creator>CSS Code Snippets : 15 Wicked Tricks &#124; DevSnippets</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 06:34:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-438859</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Eric Meyer explains why the order matters. So in case you came across the “link-visited-hover-active” (LVHA) rule. This holds that the four link states should always be listed in that order, like so: [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Eric Meyer explains why the order matters. So in case you came across the “link-visited-hover-active” (LVHA) rule. This holds that the four link states should always be listed in that order, like so: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gerrit van Aaken</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-191120</link>
		<dc:creator>Gerrit van Aaken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 07:49:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-191120</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&quot;m with Jens. My favourite rule is &quot;Lord Vader&quot;s Former Handle Anakin&quot;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8221;m with Jens. My favourite rule is &#8220;Lord Vader&#8221;s Former Handle Anakin&#8221;.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Stumpy</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-178630</link>
		<dc:creator>Stumpy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 08:25:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-178630</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I remember reading something a few years ago that used this piece of wisdom to remember the order:
[L]uther [V]andross [F]ans [H]ate [A]bba.

Brilliant.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember reading something a few years ago that used this piece of wisdom to remember the order:<br />
[L]uther [V]andross [F]ans [H]ate [A]bba.</p>
<p>Brilliant.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: David Hucklesby</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172169</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hucklesby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jun 2007 05:55:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172169</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I hope we can get this sorted. Using :focus in the middle or at the beginning works to provide keyboard users with pop-up (spanned) images. But attempting to use :active for IE users gives problems--  the :hover does not work well because the :active state &quot;sticks&quot;.

Ever the optimist, I hope there is a CSS solution to this.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope we can get this sorted. Using :focus in the middle or at the beginning works to provide keyboard users with pop-up (spanned) images. But attempting to use :active for IE users gives problems&#8211;  the :hover does not work well because the :active state &#8220;sticks&#8221;.</p>
<p>Ever the optimist, I hope there is a CSS solution to this.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mike Cherim</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172052</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Cherim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jun 2007 00:51:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172052</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I place &lt;code&gt;a:focus&lt;/code&gt; before &lt;code&gt;a:active&lt;/code&gt; -- in the typical order of use.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I place <code>a:focus</code> before <code>a:active</code> &#8212; in the typical order of use.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Max Design - standards based web design, development and training &#187; Some links for light reading (12/6/07)</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172014</link>
		<dc:creator>Max Design - standards based web design, development and training &#187; Some links for light reading (12/6/07)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 23:35:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-172014</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Ordering the Link States [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Ordering the Link States [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: GangRel</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-171166</link>
		<dc:creator>GangRel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2007 15:05:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-171166</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[i think hover should overrule focus (lvfha)

Reasoning: 
They only collide, when a mouse-user points on a focused link. at that point the user either knows that the link has focus (he saw it before hovering) or he doesnt care about it having focus. In contrast, all reasons for showing him a hover-effect to reflect his action still apply, since he obviously wants to click and not hit return to open the link.

The lvhfa argument &quot;clicking a button is what I do with them right after I gave them focus&quot; does not feel correct to me, since this &quot;giving focus&quot; is just a sideeffect of clicking/activating and not really user-intended (unlike with textfields), which will make the active:-rule instantly overwrite the focus:-rule anyway (if we stay with the example of just different colors).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i think hover should overrule focus (lvfha)</p>
<p>Reasoning:<br />
They only collide, when a mouse-user points on a focused link. at that point the user either knows that the link has focus (he saw it before hovering) or he doesnt care about it having focus. In contrast, all reasons for showing him a hover-effect to reflect his action still apply, since he obviously wants to click and not hit return to open the link.</p>
<p>The lvhfa argument &#8220;clicking a button is what I do with them right after I gave them focus&#8221; does not feel correct to me, since this &#8220;giving focus&#8221; is just a sideeffect of clicking/activating and not really user-intended (unlike with textfields), which will make the active:-rule instantly overwrite the focus:-rule anyway (if we stay with the example of just different colors).</p>
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		<title>By: thacker</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-170533</link>
		<dc:creator>thacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jun 2007 22:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-170533</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Still waiting for Meyer&#039;s analysis and reasoning on the questions that he presented.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Still waiting for Meyer&#8217;s analysis and reasoning on the questions that he presented.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jens Meiert</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-168190</link>
		<dc:creator>Jens Meiert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 18:32:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-168190</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;:link, :visited, :focus, :hover, :active&quot; should be the most useful way [...].]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;:link, :visited, :focus, :hover, :active&#8221; should be the most useful way [...].</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: patrick h. lauke</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167455</link>
		<dc:creator>patrick h. lauke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 22:17:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167455</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[off topic a bit, but: an interesting usability enhancement that i recently implemented on a site - style visited links on focus/hover differently from unvisited links on focus/hover...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>off topic a bit, but: an interesting usability enhancement that i recently implemented on a site &#8211; style visited links on focus/hover differently from unvisited links on focus/hover&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Lee</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167387</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 20:16:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167387</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Actually, that&#039;s not quite right.  I&#039;ve used &lt;strong&gt;Las Vegas Federal Housing Authority&lt;/strong&gt; to remember &lt;strong&gt;LVFHA&lt;/strong&gt;.  Fits better with Sin City&#039;s recent growth.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, that&#8217;s not quite right.  I&#8217;ve used <strong>Las Vegas Federal Housing Authority</strong> to remember <strong>LVFHA</strong>.  Fits better with Sin City&#8217;s recent growth.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Lee</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167271</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 16:55:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167271</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m going to stick with &lt;strong&gt;LVFHA&lt;/strong&gt; because I&#039;ve always used &lt;strong&gt;Las Vegas Future Homemakers of America&lt;/strong&gt; to remember the order.  Unless of course you discover some compelling reason why I should change this order and think of a new mnemonic.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to stick with <strong>LVFHA</strong> because I&#8217;ve always used <strong>Las Vegas Future Homemakers of America</strong> to remember the order.  Unless of course you discover some compelling reason why I should change this order and think of a new mnemonic.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Sebastian Redl</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167066</link>
		<dc:creator>Sebastian Redl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 12:00:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167066</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ll join the consensus and say order focus between visited and hover, but I&#039;ll take a different line of reasoning.

The most transient pseudo-class is active. It applies only during the brief time the user holds down the mouse button. Therefore it is the last. As it lasts only a short time, it should override everything else.
The most permanent class is link. It applies to any link. Therefore, it cannot override anything else, it must be the first.
Visited is next after link. It doesn&#039;t apply to all links, but it applies irregardless of current user activity; instead it depends on past user activity. Once visited applies, only time or a history purge will make it not apply.
So the question remains of the relative order of focus and hover. I&#039;d say that the mouse, which causes hovering, is quicker-moving than the keyboard focus, so hover is the more transient state and is ordered later.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll join the consensus and say order focus between visited and hover, but I&#8217;ll take a different line of reasoning.</p>
<p>The most transient pseudo-class is active. It applies only during the brief time the user holds down the mouse button. Therefore it is the last. As it lasts only a short time, it should override everything else.<br />
The most permanent class is link. It applies to any link. Therefore, it cannot override anything else, it must be the first.<br />
Visited is next after link. It doesn&#8217;t apply to all links, but it applies irregardless of current user activity; instead it depends on past user activity. Once visited applies, only time or a history purge will make it not apply.<br />
So the question remains of the relative order of focus and hover. I&#8217;d say that the mouse, which causes hovering, is quicker-moving than the keyboard focus, so hover is the more transient state and is ordered later.</p>
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		<title>By: F.O.R.</title>
		<link>http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167065</link>
		<dc:creator>F.O.R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 11:58:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/06/04/ordering-the-link-states/#comment-167065</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here&#039;s my take:

a:link {color: blue;}
a:visited {color: purple;}
a:hover {color: red;}
a:focus {color: orange;}
a:active {color: yellow;}

In other words, focus -for an anchor- fits between the active and hover states. The rationale is that I see &#039;focus&#039; as something you do right before interacting with an element.
Thus, I give focus to a textbox before I can type in it, to a button before I can click it. Anchors seem to fit the same pattern. So, hover and focus feel like they should be related, and focus and active too, since typing in a textbox, or clicking a button is what I do with them right after I gave them focus.

At least that&#039;s my story until I get more coffee.
F.O.R.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s my take:</p>
<p>a:link {color: blue;}<br />
a:visited {color: purple;}<br />
a:hover {color: red;}<br />
a:focus {color: orange;}<br />
a:active {color: yellow;}</p>
<p>In other words, focus -for an anchor- fits between the active and hover states. The rationale is that I see &#8216;focus&#8217; as something you do right before interacting with an element.<br />
Thus, I give focus to a textbox before I can type in it, to a button before I can click it. Anchors seem to fit the same pattern. So, hover and focus feel like they should be related, and focus and active too, since typing in a textbox, or clicking a button is what I do with them right after I gave them focus.</p>
<p>At least that&#8217;s my story until I get more coffee.<br />
F.O.R.</p>
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